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#95273 - 11/23/10 05:33 AM knocking in the engine  
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88TCRider Offline
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Had a really bad day yesterday and did a really dumb move, I changed the oil in the car and the seal from the old oil filter stayed attached to the block after filter removal. On the way into town the car seemed to dog down a little, so I stepped in the clutch, engine died. Then I thought I would do a rolling start, and she pulled really hard, then something seemed to "pop" and since then it made a clunking sound. I figured out what happen and got more oil in, but after driving it, it doesnít have all the power it use to, but idles fine. Still there was always a knock now. Though maybe a piston disconnected, but took all the spark plugs out and it seems that the pistons all still go up and down with the turning of the crank. Is it possible that this is a pushrod making that noise? Other ideas? I am hoping to drive this car again, but the wife is wanting to turn it into partsÖ


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95274 - 11/23/10 05:45 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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Pete D Offline
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No pushrods in this engine - overhead camshaft. Is the clunking sound related to engine speed? Does it get more frequent or louder with an increase in rpms? Is the noise coming from the top of the engine?


Pete Dunham


#95275 - 11/23/10 06:54 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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It is related to engine speed. it is hardly noticeable at idle, but terrible at high rpms. It is really hard to say where the noise is coming from, but would have to say it is mid to upper part of the engine.


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95276 - 11/23/10 07:01 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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powerhouse Offline
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Mass.
rod bearing


88 t/c
85 mustang gt 351w
81 capri 306
Powerhouse Performance Machine - race/performance engines
508-328-9884
#95277 - 11/23/10 08:44 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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RDOG Offline
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Hate to say it, but it sounds like a rod bearing. When a bearing goes many times it sounds like its coming from the top of engine but its not the case. Usually a bad rod bearing.


1986 Turbo Coupe. Boport StageIII head, Boport 2.1, Performance Techniques 50 trim hybird, StageII.63, stinger 3" exhaust, Phenolic spacer, Boglog header,NPR FMIC intercooler setup, kirban fpr, bigrmotorsports fuel rail, diablo water meth kit, CAI, remote mount TFI, CHE rear adj control arms, MAC girdle, 8.8 rear disc, aluminum drive shaft, H&R lowerings springs Tbird Turbo Specific, y MAS!!
#95278 - 11/23/10 04:35 PM Re: knocking in the engine  
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TurboE Offline
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Pa
Rod bearing was my first thought


-88 TC Black
5spd, Precision SC50 T3/T4, QH/SD Tune, Gillis, AFPR, 255FP, WB O2, K&N, Ported E6, 3" DP, ATR 2.5" Duals, 3:73 Rear, Konis, Eibachs, 18" Voxx Wheels, X Drilled Rotors.
-06 G35 Coupe Diamond Graphite
-97 Pathfinder
#95279 - 11/23/10 09:33 PM Re: knocking in the engine  
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88TCRider Offline
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Sioux Falls SD
So the motor needs to come out and put in new rod bearings. I don't suppose there is any way to get that oil pan off without taking the motor all the way out?


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95280 - 11/23/10 09:43 PM Re: knocking in the engine  
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Pete D Offline
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Northern OH
You can get the pan out without yanking the engine. You do have to loosen the motor mounts and jack up the engine. There are some past posts about it


Pete Dunham


#95281 - 11/24/10 01:28 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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jangus Offline
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If you lost oil pressure long enough to take out a rod bearing, you may as well replace ALL the rod AND main bearings.


88TC 5speed, 160,000+, ranger roller, Evergreen T3, cone filter, manual boost controller.
One parts car still waiting to be taken apart.
Waiting in the garage: SC throttle body, SC intercooler, graphic equalizer, among other things.
#95282 - 11/24/10 02:29 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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russ c Offline
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Quote:
Originally posted by jangus:
If you lost oil pressure long enough to take out a rod bearing, you may as well replace ALL the rod AND main bearings.
+1


86TC Saved from certain death
88TC Gave its life so other TCs could live.
88TC DD.
#95283 - 11/24/10 06:47 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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88TCRider Offline
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Sioux Falls SD
From the sounds of other posts, getting the oil pan off without taking the motor out is a PITA. I am wondering if I should just plan to pull the motor, or try while still in the car? I am sure pulling the motor isn't that much fun either.


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95284 - 11/24/10 06:48 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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88TCRider Offline
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Sioux Falls SD
Also, would I be able to replace all the bearings if I don't take the motor out?


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95285 - 11/24/10 07:08 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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jangus Offline
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NO. At this point, you should either pull the motor and replace the bearings, or pull it and drop another in it's place.
If it's not your daily driver, I'd just pull it and replace the bearings. You can get the bearings decently priced.


88TC 5speed, 160,000+, ranger roller, Evergreen T3, cone filter, manual boost controller.
One parts car still waiting to be taken apart.
Waiting in the garage: SC throttle body, SC intercooler, graphic equalizer, among other things.
#95286 - 11/24/10 07:26 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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powerhouse Offline
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Mass.
most likely the crank is damaged so just putting in new bearings wont work. plan on pulling and disassembling the engine and having the crank checked by a machine shop.


88 t/c
85 mustang gt 351w
81 capri 306
Powerhouse Performance Machine - race/performance engines
508-328-9884
#95287 - 11/24/10 07:52 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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RDOG Offline
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I would pull it. Its a 2.5 hour job with a cherry picker and hand tools for me. There are other guys here who can actually do it in an hour or less.


1986 Turbo Coupe. Boport StageIII head, Boport 2.1, Performance Techniques 50 trim hybird, StageII.63, stinger 3" exhaust, Phenolic spacer, Boglog header,NPR FMIC intercooler setup, kirban fpr, bigrmotorsports fuel rail, diablo water meth kit, CAI, remote mount TFI, CHE rear adj control arms, MAC girdle, 8.8 rear disc, aluminum drive shaft, H&R lowerings springs Tbird Turbo Specific, y MAS!!
#95288 - 11/24/10 08:12 PM Re: knocking in the engine  
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TurboE Offline
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Pa
As said, i would pull it. Decide whether you just want to buy one to drop in. Once you pull it apart and either check the bearings/crank/cam tolerances or have someone else do it you will most likely want to replace all the bearings? However i dont know your budget and timeframe to get it fixed.

I had a head gasket go and it had a cracked head. Lucky me i had a replacement head but then i couldn't get the engine to not knock like crazy. Thought it was just HLA's for a while. Pulled the engine, all the bearings were wiped and the everything was out of round (way beyond the tolerance). Ended up rebuilding another engine (because i had one less abused by the previous owner, the car was used from someone i didnt know). Not to say that will happen to you but just to mention once you get so far apart it only makes sense to do other critical parts/bearings while its apart.


-88 TC Black
5spd, Precision SC50 T3/T4, QH/SD Tune, Gillis, AFPR, 255FP, WB O2, K&N, Ported E6, 3" DP, ATR 2.5" Duals, 3:73 Rear, Konis, Eibachs, 18" Voxx Wheels, X Drilled Rotors.
-06 G35 Coupe Diamond Graphite
-97 Pathfinder
#95289 - 11/24/10 10:25 PM Re: knocking in the engine  
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Paulie Offline
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LA
Sir sorry for your problem. But pulling the engine is basically the easiest way to do the job. I would buy a reground crank and it comes with bearings of the proper Undersized. That will be the easiest way to fix the bottom end. I have seen double gaskets many of times on engines and its something to be aware of when doing an oil change. One thing i always do is clean off the filter gasket mating surface with a lint free rag. This does 2 things it makes you check for the old gasket and it cleans the mating surface. This happens quite frequently and is more common than you think. Always check the block and the old filter for the gasket. This in time will be something that wont happen on new engines. The feds are cracking down on spin on filters. The car companies will have to design cartridge filters in the future for environmental reasons. Good luck Sir and sorry for the miss hap.


Paulie

HAVE YOU DRIVEN A FORD LATELY??

I spend money i don't have. Building cars i don't need. To impress people i don't know!!
#95290 - 11/25/10 05:33 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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88TCRider Offline
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Sioux Falls SD
Well, I have gotten things ready to start the pull. Fluids are draining, bench cleared, and rusty bolts soaking in wd40. Picking up my dadís cherry picker tomorrow. I was hoping that I wouldn't have to deal with timing, but we'll see what it looks like when it gets out. This was my daily driver, but I do have a F150 that will take its place for as long as it needs to be out. Next question may be if I should replace the clutch while the motor is out, but again donít really want to be dropping too much money into the car.


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95291 - 11/25/10 06:52 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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88TCRider Offline
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Sioux Falls SD
Wow, crankshafts are not cheep on ebay, I am hoping that mine will be ok.


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95292 - 11/28/10 10:02 PM Re: knocking in the engine  
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Sioux Falls SD
Well, the engine is just about out. Motor mounts and one bolt conecting the engine to the trany then she can come out. But I am wondering how to disconect the torque converter on the manual trany.


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95293 - 11/29/10 12:39 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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zbird Offline
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If you are talking about the pressure plate, you don't need to remove it. Just disconnect the slave cylinder from the side of the trans and remove all the bell housing bolts. The Input shaft will slide right out of the clutch/pressure plate assy when you pull the motor. They can stay attached to the flywheel. You can change the clutch if you want while you are rebuilding the motor. I would hate to have to pull the trans from the engine twice. Good luck.


Dom Z
88 T/C med grey. 140 MPH Speedo, Kirban FPR, Gillis valve,Tripminder, K&N.
87 T/C Silver, Auto (project Daily driver)
99 F150 4x4
14 Ford Escape 2.0L Turbo
IF YOU DRIVE A FORD YOU DON'T NEED A GOODWRENCH!!
88 T/C http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZihO_D1FLCE
87 Silver http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_dVU5axnb...mp;feature=plcp
#95294 - 11/29/10 12:41 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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jangus Offline
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Nebraska
Seriously? The manual trans won't have a torque converter. Just and FYI, I've found it easier to take the trans out with a manual setup, and leave the trans in the car with an automatic.


88TC 5speed, 160,000+, ranger roller, Evergreen T3, cone filter, manual boost controller.
One parts car still waiting to be taken apart.
Waiting in the garage: SC throttle body, SC intercooler, graphic equalizer, among other things.
#95295 - 11/29/10 01:52 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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Pete D Offline
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Northern OH
If you don't take the manual trans out with the engine, you need to support the front of the trans so it doesn't drop down and put stress on other components.


Pete Dunham


#95296 - 11/29/10 02:25 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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88TCRider Offline
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Sioux Falls SD
I guess I have never taken a engine with a manual trany out before, always been automatics. I have all the bolts -1 out of the bell housing, the top two were a lot of fun, jut a bottom one left. I don't have a very deep garage, so I don't have a lot of room to bring everything forward to take the trany with the engine. I have a couple of floor jacks and stands to set the trany on. On the clutch, are they all created equal, or is there one better than another out there? I am leaning more and more to replacing it. It has been getting to the point where at higher RPMs the RPMs would increas faster than the speed.


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95297 - 11/29/10 02:37 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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Paulie Offline
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LA
Sir i have been pulling engines out of manual tranny cars for more years than i would like to admit. It is not necessary to remove the tranny. As Peter points out the transmission has to be jacked up when installing or removing the motor. This way the motor and tranny will be on the same horizontal plane and slip right in or out. Been doing this for many many years with no problem at all. Its not necessary to remove a manual or auto tranny. Leaving the tranny in saves a lot of time and energy. Hope this helps gentlemen


Paulie

HAVE YOU DRIVEN A FORD LATELY??

I spend money i don't have. Building cars i don't need. To impress people i don't know!!
#95298 - 11/29/10 04:34 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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Pete D Offline
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Pete D  Offline
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Northern OH
Quote:
It has been getting to the point where at higher RPMs the RPMs would increas faster than the speed.
This is a real good sign that it's time to replace the clutch. What you use is kind of dependent on where you are going to take the engine power wise.
If you are going to keep it stock or near stock and don't drag it (much) then a stock type replacement should do you well and be cheaper. If you plan significant mods and or want to do a lot of drag strip activity, then you are going to need to upgrade. It also important to resurface or replace the flywheel. Also do the pilot bearing.
There are lots of past post, both on the procedure and what others have used for clutch/pressure plate combos


Pete Dunham


#95299 - 11/30/10 04:58 PM Re: knocking in the engine  
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thumper Offline
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I bought a LuK brand clutch on eBay on the cheap about 2 years ago. Don't remember how much I paid... maybe $118 for the kit. It was a clutch vendor on there, not somebody selling one personally.

I just leave the manual trans on when I pull it. Easier for me, I guess. I don't know if its really easier... I just really really hate those top two bell housing bolts.


A.K.A. Corey Bennett

1988 TC: white, all options, 5-speed swap, K&N cone filter, "Ranger" roller camshaft, .60/.63 T3, NXS (Gillis-style) Boost Valve, Bosch BOV w/ check valve, Stinger 3" with axle dump (18" glass pack), 95A 3G

Some pictures: http://s639.photobucket.com/albums/uu111/cbennett4041/
#95300 - 12/02/10 06:19 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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88TCRider Offline
Boosting 10 psi
88TCRider  Offline
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Sioux Falls SD
I know what you mean about those two top bolts! They were a lot of fun. Got the motor out tonight. The thing is a pig covered in oil. I think that the valve cover has been leaking for a long time. Tomorrow I am hoping to take the pan off and see what things look like.


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95301 - 12/05/10 05:47 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 171
88TCRider Offline
Boosting 10 psi
88TCRider  Offline
Boosting 10 psi

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Posts: 171
Sioux Falls SD
The #1 conecting rod bearing and the main bearing between #1 and #2 are cooked. I have the crank out, and am planning to get it ground. There are two copper colored marks on the crank on the cooked bearing. I am hopping to get by with just doing this and all new bearings. I guess I will also have to replace the clutch. That is shot also. Everything is basically smooth on the clutch, and grooves on the bearing.


88 TC 241K:
T3, bored .030 over block and bowl blended, harden seat added, un-cracked head from an 84 TC. Ranger Roller cam, upgraded valve springs, CP forged pistons, self-polished upper and lower intake, mild ported un-cracked E6, cold air intake, bypass valve, looking for 3" exhaust.
#95302 - 12/05/10 08:41 AM Re: knocking in the engine  
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gmaibach Offline
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gmaibach  Offline
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Sterling, Ohio
i guess ive done too many trannys because i can do a clutch job on my tc in less than an hour and the top 2 bolts are easy... i dont even use a lift :)


1988 Turbo Coupe 5 speed Red with Red cloth interior, K&N cone filter, Ported IHI turbo, ATR Header ported, Manual Boost Controller at 18 psi.

2013 Focus ST 2.0 Turbo, Buschur green filter, OCD Speed axle back exhaust.
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